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Were the Refs THAT bad???

Electric Chair

Well-Known Member
#1
I am wondering if the refs were as bad for those at home that had the convenience of replay as they were from where I was sitting? There were some truly POS calls from my vantage point, to the extent that I was certain that the refs had money on the outcome.

The Browns were bailed out of too many tight situations for my liking, and as a whole I thought that they called a garbage game. Is this just me?

This type of thing is hard to decifer at the game... But those refs today can KMA and SMD!!!!!
 

MasterOfPuppets

Charger fan since 1979
#3
watching on tv the only bad call was a late PI penalty on Cromartie (I think) while the ball sailed about 10 feet over the reciever, other than that I saw no big problems

The McCardell fumble was a fumble, the Robinson late hit was way way late, et.
 

MMJ4mil

BoltTalker
#4
dude it was horrible man, i was crying.

at the game i thought this was too good to be true for a homegame.

no help at all.
 

Chavez

Well-Known Member
#5
The refs were bad but we made some pretty bone-head plays on our own. If we had lost that game I don't think I could have blamed it on the refs.
 

Boltdiehard

Well-Known Member
#6
MasterOfPuppets said:
watching on tv the only bad call was a late PI penalty on Cromartie (I think) while the ball sailed about 10 feet over the reciever, other than that I saw no big problems

The McCardell fumble was a fumble, the Robinson late hit was way way late, et.
The illegal use of the hands on Jammer was complete BS; that and Cleveland was holding ALL fugging day (and they still couldn't run). There was one other BS call but I can't remember right now. :icon_huh:
 

MasterOfPuppets

Charger fan since 1979
#7
Chavez said:
The refs were bad but we made some pretty bone-head plays on our own. If we had lost that game I don't think I could have blamed it on the refs.
I agree, most stupid penalties where the fault of the players (Robinsons late hit, calling two timeout back-to-back where the worst)
 

MasterOfPuppets

Charger fan since 1979
#8
Boltdiehard said:
The illegal use of the hands on Jammer was complete BS; that and Cleveland was holding ALL fugging day (and they still couldn't run). There was one other BS call but I can't remember right now. :icon_huh:
yeah, and one play where Winslow pushed off against a defender's face mask to make a catch
 
#9
MasterOfPuppets said:
I agree, most stupid penalties where the fault of the players (Robinsons late hit, calling two timeout back-to-back where the worst)
that late hit was funny thoiugh, dude just did not stop. :lol: :lol:
 

AnteaterRaider

Carpe Diem et omni Mundio
Staff member
Super Moderator
Podcaster
#10
the Derrick Robinson late hit was a legit penalty
there were at least seven calls that were BS and 5 of them changed momentum/gave a first down
 

boltmanbz

Well-Known Member
#14
PostAnteaterCharger said:
the Derrick Robinson late hit was a legit penalty
there were at least seven calls that were BS and 5 of them changed momentum/gave a first down
they didnt blow the whistle and the flag throw for the time delay was in the secondary so im not sure he saw it
 
#15
Wasn't just this game that there were some pretty questionable calls. Watched a few games today and it was pretty crappy all day.:icon_huh:
 

AnteaterRaider

Carpe Diem et omni Mundio
Staff member
Super Moderator
Podcaster
#16
boltmanbz said:
they didnt blow the whistle and the flag throw for the time delay was in the secondary so im not sure he saw it
I'm taking notes for the podcast here are the ones I saw
Fracked up calls

1. KM Fumble – he was down
2. Holding on Jammer on the fumble recovery starting 3rd quarter
3. Two time outs in a row – personal foul?
4. Holding third quarter on Florence when center hank fraley tackled jamal Williams in front of the referee
5. block in the back on first half punt return when there were three holds
6. Face Mask Penalty on Randal Godfrey – how is it when you don’t bring them down. Godfrey had two 15yd penalties
7. Ironically enough the Rivers no grounding call in 4th was a bad call
8. No facemask call on KWII for shoving Kiel in his face outside of the 5yds 4h Q 7:08
 

Boltdiehard

Well-Known Member
#18
Is anybody watching the Colts/Pats? Brady did not get a 1st down on the fourth down play. Not even close.

As far as the K-Mac fumble the whistle blew and he was ruled down by contact. WTF happened after that still has me wondering.
 

MasterOfPuppets

Charger fan since 1979
#19
PostAnteaterCharger said:
1. KM Fumble – he was down
sorry to say, but he wasn't

PostAnteaterCharger said:
3. Two time outs in a row – personal foul?
haven't checked the rule book, but if it's there, it's there :icon_shrug:
PostAnteaterCharger said:
6. Face Mask Penalty on Randal Godfrey – how is it when you don’t bring them down. Godfrey had two 15yd penalties
should have been a 5 yarder, but it was against a QB so you knew it was going to be a 15 yarder :tdown:
PostAnteaterCharger said:
7. Ironically enough the Rivers no grounding call in 4th was a bad call
strange thing that the commentators said he had to be "outside the hashmarks", the way I understand it he has to be outside the tackles
PostAnteaterCharger said:
8. No facemask call on KWII for shoving Kiel in his face outside of the 5yds 4h Q 7:08
Agree
 
#20
PostAnteaterCharger said:
I'm taking notes for the podcast here are the ones I saw
Fracked up calls

1. KM Fumble – he was down
2. Holding on Jammer on the fumble recovery starting 3rd quarter
3. Two time outs in a row – personal foul?
4. Holding third quarter on Florence when center hank fraley tackled jamal Williams in front of the referee
5. block in the back on first half punt return when there were three holds
6. Face Mask Penalty on Randal Godfrey – how is it when you don’t bring them down. Godfrey had two 15yd penalties
7. Ironically enough the Rivers no grounding call in 4th was a bad call
8. No facemask call on KWII for shoving Kiel in his face outside of the 5yds 4h Q 7:08
These were the problems I had. The penalty on Jammer to start the second-half was playacting by the receiver. Jammer did NOT initiate contact, the receiver did. And the fact that it had nothing to do with the outcome of the play just drives me nuts.

The personal foul call on Godfrey was BS. Yes, it was a facemask. No, it should NOT have been a personal foul. It should've been of the 5-yard variety.

The pass-interference call against Cromartie was BS because the ball was nowhere near being catchable. The receiver was in front of Cromartie and the ball was about 5 feet over Cro's head.

The McCardell fumble should not have been overturned because the replay showed he regained control of the ball on his way down and the ground caused the fumble. I don't think that replay was conclusive to overturn the call on the field.

The two-timeouts-in-a-row penalty is a league rule. I don't think the refs had much of a choice in that one.

SO, the Chargers got screwed several times in the first three quarters, so then you start seeing the "makeup calls" in the 4th quarter--the PF on the hit on LT, the non-call on Rivers' grounding--and that's no way to officiate a damned game.
 
#21
The only thing that I will say is that I think that the refs wanted the Browns to win because of what I saw today in person because the refs just sucked arse. They almost handed the game to the Brown Stains. On many times in the game.
 

Trumpet_Man

Well-Known Member
#22
The holding on the Browns Offensive line was ridiculous.

When I saw Jamal jumping up and down like a kid who had his candy stolen, I knew it was out of hand. Jamel does not pitch a biitch about holding or I have never seen him so animated about the non-calls.

We had too many stupid penalties. 13 penalties for 113 yards.

The first half of the game was horrific.

Steve Crosby needs to have his *** FIRED.

The Special teams despite many playing both ways on defense, really took its toll. The field position and overall play was horrid as well.

Sci-Fi is the only thing working and his 66 yard kick was freaking awesome in person.

It is fun to watch LoNeal run. :icon_mrgreen:
 
#23
Trumpet_Man said:
The holding on the Browns Offensive line was ridiculous.

When I saw Jamal jumping up and down like a kid who had his candy stolen, I knew it was out of hand. Jamel does not pitch a biitch about holding or I have never seen him so animated about the non-calls.

We had too many stupid penalties. 13 penalties for 113 yards.

The first half of the game was horrific.

Steve Crosby needs to have his *** FIRED.

The Special teams despite many playing both ways on defense, really took its toll. The field position and overall play was horrid as well.

Sci-Fi is the only thing working and his 66 yard kick was freaking awesome in person.

It is fun to watch LoNeal run. :icon_mrgreen:
Fire Steve Crosby now please before he gets this team a critical loss.

I agree about Jamal jumping like a mexican jumping bean saying WTF about the constant non calls from the refs.

Lo Lo ran his arse off.
 

bigcarson50

Well-Known Member
#24
PostAnteaterCharger said:
I'm taking notes for the podcast here are the ones I saw
Fracked up calls

1. KM Fumble – he was down
2. Holding on Jammer on the fumble recovery starting 3rd quarter
3. Two time outs in a row – personal foul?
4. Holding third quarter on Florence when center hank fraley tackled jamal Williams in front of the referee
5. block in the back on first half punt return when there were three holds
6. Face Mask Penalty on Randal Godfrey – how is it when you don’t bring them down. Godfrey had two 15yd penalties
7. Ironically enough the Rivers no grounding call in 4th was a bad call
8. No facemask call on KWII for shoving Kiel in his face outside of the 5yds 4h Q 7:08

Sorry Ant, I hate to be a ref apologist, but

1. He wasn't down.
2. It wasn't holding on Jammer it was illegal contact past 5 yards and he was contacting him 10 yds down the field.
3. That's the rule.
4. That should have been a hold on Jamal, but Florence did hold as well.
5. don't know
6. Godfrey did grab the face mask, doesn't matter if you bring him down or not.
7. Agreed.
8. Facemasks are rarely called on offensive players and we should be thankful, LT is a master at it.

Edit: On number six, I might agree that maybe it should have been a 5 yarder, but since it was a QB, they are always going to call it.

I do agree that the holding on the Oline was pretty bad, but as a team, we played pretty sloppy and played ourselves into many of those penalties.
 

Electric Chair

Well-Known Member
#25
If a QB is outside the tackle box (about two steps in either East/West direction), as long as he throws the ball past the LOS it isn't grounding. BY RULE it isn't grounding. Not sure what you guys that think that was grounding by PR in the 4th were watching. He was obviously outside the tackle box and threw the ball away past the LOS...Smart play.
 

Trumpet_Man

Well-Known Member
#26
bigcarson50 said:
Sorry Ant, I hate to be a ref apologist, but

1. He wasn't down.
2. It wasn't holding on Jammer it was illegal contact past 5 yards and he was contacting him 10 yds down the field.
3. That's the rule.
4. That should have been a hold on Jamal, but Florence did hold as well.
5. don't know
6. Godfrey did grab the face mask, doesn't matter if you bring him down or not.
7. Agreed.
8. Facemasks are rarely called on offensive players and we should be thankful, LT is a master at it.

Edit: On number six, I might agree that maybe it should have been a 5 yarder, but since it was a QB, they are always going to call it.

I do agree that the holding on the Oline was pretty bad, but as a team, we played pretty sloppy and played ourselves into many of those penalties.
On the McCardell fumble play, the ball was moving then McCardell re-secured the balll and then the ground forced the fumble. That is that way it looked after watching the replays at the Murph.
 

Trumpet_Man

Well-Known Member
#27
Electric Chair said:
If a QB is outside the tackle box (about two steps in either East/West direction), as long as he throws the ball past the LOS it isn't grounding. BY RULE it isn't grounding. Not sure what you guys that think that was grounding by PR in the 4th were watching. He was obviously outside the tackle box and threw the ball away past the LOS...Smart play.
I am not sure as well. The refs simply conferred to make sure Rivers was out beyond the tackle because the ball clearly went beyond the LOS.

Rivers was pisssed and got into the refs and I am not sure if the cameras picked ths up but that was no where close to being intentional grounding. :no:
 

nickelbolt

Fuggedaboutit
#28
While Keenan may have fumbled the ball, the fact is that he was ruled down by contact. The referee said as much... and then he went on to review and overturn the call.

When you're down by contact the play is DEAD. Anything that happens after that is not a factor.

So yeah... he fumbled, but he was ruled "down by contact"... it should not have been a reviewable play.

For more proof, you need only look at tonight's game where Maroney got hit by Bob Sanders and fumbled... but he was ruled down by contact. The referees did not review the play.

The Keenan play was complete BS and I'm shocked Marty wasn't raising a stink about it. (or was he?) That drive was gaining momentum and the overturned call killed it. :icon_evil:
 

bigcarson50

Well-Known Member
#29
I thought he may have resecurred it as well, but here is how I viewed it (incorrectly or not)

I thought there was conclusive evidence that he fumbled it, but that there was inconclusive evidence that he resecurred it, especially as his hand was in a fist on the ball (not holding the ball in his palm and fingers).

Keep in mind that as a rule of thumb, I wish they would let more fumbles happen. Players should hold on to the ball period.
 

bigcarson50

Well-Known Member
#30
nickelbolt said:
While Keenan may have fumbled the ball, the fact is that he was ruled down by contact. The referee said as much... and then he went on to review and overturn the call.

When you're down by contact the play is DEAD. Anything that happens after that is not a factor.

So yeah... he fumbled, but he was ruled "down by contact"... it should not have been a reviewable play.

For more proof, you need only look at tonight's game where Maroney got hit by Bob Sanders and fumbled... but he was ruled down by contact. The referees did not review the play.

The Keenan play was complete BS and I'm shocked Marty wasn't raising a stink about it. (or was he?) That drive was gaining momentum and the overturned call killed it. :icon_evil:
That is a rule that was changed this last offseason, my understanding is that in those situations, if the whistle hasn't blown, it can be reviewed (the way it should be). So if the whistle doesn't blow until after the scrum is going, the refs can get together and then decide what the ruling on the field is, but since they didn't blow the whistle until after the recovery no player should have stopped, so it is fair to award possession to the other team, even though the initial call is down by contact (college used this method first).
 

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