Astros manager and GM suspended one year for cheating

SDRay

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Astros' Jeff Luhnow, AJ Hinch fired for sign stealing


Houston Astros general manager Jeff Luhnow and manager AJ Hinch were fired by owner Jim Crane Monday following Major League Baseball's announcement of discipline in the sign-stealing scandal.

A league investigation confirmed the Astros had cheated by using a camera-based sign-stealing system during the regular season and playoffs of their World Series-winning 2017 season.

Luhnow and Hinch were suspended for the 2020 season, but Crane said the team wanted to go beyond that ruling.

"We need to move forward with a clean slate," he said.

As part of the league's penalty, the Astros will also lose first- and second-round draft picks in 2020 and 2021, and the organization was fined a record $5 million. MLB said in its statement that if Luhnow or Hinch "engage in any future material violations" of MLB rules, they will be placed on the league's permanently ineligible list.

Boston Red Sox manager Alex Cora, who was implicated in the schemes, was not disciplined but is expected to receive a similarly harsh penalty upon the completion of an investigation into illicit use of a video replay room by the 2018 Red Sox. Cora was the Astros' bench coach during the 2017 season.
 
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Fender57

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Astros' Jeff Luhnow, AJ Hinch fired for sign stealing


Houston Astros general manager Jeff Luhnow and manager AJ Hinch were fired by owner Jim Crane Monday following Major League Baseball's announcement of discipline in the sign-stealing scandal.

A league investigation confirmed the Astros had cheated by using a camera-based sign-stealing system during the regular season and playoffs of their World Series-winning 2017 season.

Luhnow and Hinch were suspended for the 2020 season, but Crane said the team wanted to go beyond that ruling.

"We need to move forward with a clean slate," he said.

As part of the league's penalty, the Astros will also lose first- and second-round draft picks in 2020 and 2021, and the organization was fined a record $5 million. MLB said in its statement that if Luhnow or Hinch "engage in any future material violations" of MLB rules, they will be placed on the league's permanently ineligible list.

Boston Red Sox manager Alex Cora, who was implicated in the schemes, was not disciplined but is expected to receive a similarly harsh penalty upon the completion of an investigation into illicit use of a video replay room by the 2018 Red Sox. Cora was the Astros' bench coach during the 2017 season.
Wow, if they fire Cora that’s two championship managers in a row.
 

FiftyFive

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Kudos to both the MLB and the Astros' owner for making it clear that cheating is not acceptable. The NFL should be embarrassed by how poorly they've handled the Cheatriots' scandals by comparison.
 

Fender57

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Can they suspend AJ Preller for a year? He cheated, and, worse, his team sucked anyway.
They suspended him for like 30 days and did not fire him for some reason. But Mike Dee was fired shortly thereafter. So my thought was Dee took the fall for whatever happened there (they never disclosed the reason for firing Dee and the terms of the dismissal was “negotiated”).
 

Quetzalcoatl

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They suspended him for like 30 days and did not fire him for some reason. But Mike Dee was fired shortly thereafter. So my thought was Dee took the fall for whatever happened there (they never disclosed the reason for firing Dee and the terms of the dismissal was “negotiated”).
Word.
What is the lesson here?
Even if it causes cheating, never cut your Dee.
 

Quetzalcoatl

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MLB buried the small-market Stros like the NFL did to the Saints a few years back. Let's see what is does to the cheatin' Red Sox and Dodgers. My guess is nothing.
 

Gill Man

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They should also take away the World Series title in which they were also caught cheating against the Dodgers. Just take the trophy/title away. WTF. That should be a no brainer and would further reinforce what they've done thus far.
 

Fender57

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They should also take away the World Series title in which they were also caught cheating against the Dodgers. Just take the trophy/title away. WTF. That should be a no brainer and would further reinforce what they've done thus far.
It would be the right thing to do, would be a gutsy move, and it would solidify the integrity of Major League Baseball.
 

Quetzalcoatl

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They should also take away the World Series title in which they were also caught cheating against the Dodgers. Just take the trophy/title away. WTF. That should be a no brainer and would further reinforce what they've done thus far.
Hell no. Dodgers cheat too. Ask the Brewers.
 

Fender57

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The championship should be officially recorded as, "Fuck the Dodgers."
After the Red Sox gets penalized for their cheating:

World Series Champions last 5 years:
2015 - Kansas City Royals
2016 - Chicago Cubs
2017 - Fuck the Dodgers
2018 - Fuck the Dodgers
2019 - Washington Nationals

Looks good.
 
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Gill Man

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Hell no. Dodgers cheat too. Ask the Brewers.
2, 3 evils don't make a right for Houston. They got caught. The others should suffer the same if caught. BTW just watching ESPN this morning and Stephen A and he brings up a GREAT point. There were guys on that team caught cheating who went to other teams. Alex Cora to the Red Sox and they end up winning the World Series! Another guy to the Mets. They BOTH should be fired from their current positions and thrown out of the league. THEIR titles should be taken away as well. Stephen A. says the situation is absolutely catastrophic for baseball. I'd agree. They got themselves a huge problem.

I think this extends obviously to other sports like football as well. Obviously we know about the cheatriots, and that Ernie Adams guy. Obviously the Niners cheated the cap back in the 80's. The moral in sports is if you don't cheat you don't win. You can extend it to the individual player level and I believe MANY of these guys if not MOST are cheating the PED system by taking supplements that allow them to go undetected. You do not bulk up like players then suddenly become a skinng skrawny guy in one year like Hardwick did. I don't give a damn if he stopped lifting as many weights. He stopped supplementing. Same with all of em. I would BET you that 'incredible' D line of # 1 picks on the Niner team is all supplementing big time and getting aroundthe system. You simply cannot be THAT much stronger/quicker than the avg. O lineman . The Chargers of the 60's did it that way, I hate to admit that. Sid Gillman figured out how to game the system legally...steroids were still legal before they knew what they did and Sid and Co. knew it and used it before the others had caught on. Thus their D line of Faison, Ladd, et al were WAY faster and stronger than the opposing O lines. I think it's happening right now with the Niners .....I'd wager a huge amount it is. I know I know, they test. BS...the tests can be worked around and gamed as is....there is always a cutting edge solution they can use that goes undetected. Others will figure it out and use it finally.

Sports is corrupt, especially baseball and football. Eff it. Currently I am really down on it all. I love sports, but I hate that I know in my heart and mind they aren't legit anymore. Then for football and baseball you throw in the crappy officials and umpires and subjective officiating on each and every play just about and it's that much worse. SCAM. One big effing SCAM.
 
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Fender57

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2, 3 evils don't make a right for Houston. They got caught. The others should suffer the same if caught. BTW just watching ESPN this morning and Stephen A and he brings up a GREAT point. There were guys on that team caught cheating who went to other teams. Alex Cora to the Red Sox and they end up winning the World Series! Another guy to the Mets. They BOTH should be fired from their current positions and thrown out of the league. THEIR titles should be taken away as well. Stephen A. says the situation is absolutely catastrophic for baseball. I'd agree. They got themselves a huge problem.

I think this extends obviously to other sports like football as well. Obviously we know about the cheatriots, and that Ernie Adams guy. Obviously the Niners cheated the cap back in the 80's. The moral in sports is if you don't cheat you don't win. You can extend it to the individual player level and I believe MANY of these guys if not MOST are cheating the PED system by taking supplements that allow them to go undetected. You do not bulk up like players then suddenly become a skinng skrawny guy in one year like Hardwick did. I don't give a damn if he stopped lifting as many weights. He stopped supplementing. Same with all of em. I would BET you that 'incredible' D line of # 1 picks on the Niner team is all supplementing big time and getting aroundthe system. You simply cannot be THAT much stronger/quicker than the avg. O lineman . The Chargers of the 60's did it that way, I hate to admit that. Sid Gillman figured out how to game the system legally...steroids were still legal before they knew what they did and Sid and Co. knew it and used it before the others had caught on. Thus their D line of Faison, Ladd, et al were WAY faster and stronger than the opposing O lines. I think it's happening right now with the Niners .....I'd wager a huge amount it is. I know I know, they test. BS...the tests can be worked around and gamed as is....there is always a cutting edge solution they can use that goes undetected. Others will figure it out and use it finally.

Sports is corrupt, especially baseball and football. Eff it. Currently I am really down on it all. I love sports, but I hate that I know in my heart and mind they aren't legit anymore. Then for football and baseball you throw in the crappy officials and umpires and subjective officiating on each and every play just about and it's that much worse. SCAM. One big effing SCAM.
The big thing stopping MLB from going after the players is the MLBPA. They have collectively bargained a grievance process and this issue blows everything up. Much easier to fire the executives.

I think Cora is a goner. They should fire Beltran too but he was a player at the time, but they don’t want to go after him and not the whole Astros team and invoke the ire of the union.

Another thing (which is why the Doggers are so willing to keep their mouths shut) is I’m sure they all cheat. Such a precarious situation they find themselves in.
 
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Gill Man

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The big thing stopping MLB from going after the players is the MLBPA. They have collectively bargained a grievance process and this issue blows everything up. Much easier to fire the executives.

I think Cora is a goner. They should fire Beltran too but he was a player at the time, but they don’t want to go after him and not the whole Astros team and invoke the ire of the union.

Another thing (which is why the Doggers are so willing to keep their mouths shut) is I’m sure they all cheat. Such a precarious situation they find themselves in.
eff the players associations.....they are nothing but shills. Great a union that helps players get away with cheating and roiding up or doing whatever the hell they want. Yeah hopefully Cora a goner and Beltran a goner. I hated those Astros teams frankly....they were all smug and that Houston Strong BS was FOS. Now then end up looking like a bunch of scam artists not much better than the looters who benefited from the natural disaster that struck. Eff them. Eff them all and their players union.

Any yeah they likely ALL cheat. It's not unlike the steroid controversy that destroyed baseball's reputation and forever ruined the credibility of any and all records during that era. This is probably just as bad if not worse. Whole game is once again damaged and it's a shame because America's pasttime is a great game. It's the folks playing it to win AT ALL COSTS that have ruined it for everyone and the ones hurt most are the fans who used to think it was a real sport. Might as well make it fantasy baseball now. If they don't come down really hard and take away all player records on that team and the series titles and fire everyone involved with it, even if they've gone to other teams, they will keep the stain on baseball's image. Up to them how they want to be perceived. This one requires full investigaton and absolute punishment...same as Pete Rose had to deal with.
 

Quetzalcoatl

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2, 3 evils don't make a right for Houston. They got caught. The others should suffer the same if caught. BTW just watching ESPN this morning and Stephen A and he brings up a GREAT point. There were guys on that team caught cheating who went to other teams. Alex Cora to the Red Sox and they end up winning the World Series! Another guy to the Mets. They BOTH should be fired from their current positions and thrown out of the league. THEIR titles should be taken away as well. Stephen A. says the situation is absolutely catastrophic for baseball. I'd agree. They got themselves a huge problem.

I think this extends obviously to other sports like football as well. Obviously we know about the cheatriots, and that Ernie Adams guy. Obviously the Niners cheated the cap back in the 80's. The moral in sports is if you don't cheat you don't win. You can extend it to the individual player level and I believe MANY of these guys if not MOST are cheating the PED system by taking supplements that allow them to go undetected. You do not bulk up like players then suddenly become a skinng skrawny guy in one year like Hardwick did. I don't give a damn if he stopped lifting as many weights. He stopped supplementing. Same with all of em. I would BET you that 'incredible' D line of # 1 picks on the Niner team is all supplementing big time and getting aroundthe system. You simply cannot be THAT much stronger/quicker than the avg. O lineman . The Chargers of the 60's did it that way, I hate to admit that. Sid Gillman figured out how to game the system legally...steroids were still legal before they knew what they did and Sid and Co. knew it and used it before the others had caught on. Thus their D line of Faison, Ladd, et al were WAY faster and stronger than the opposing O lines. I think it's happening right now with the Niners .....I'd wager a huge amount it is. I know I know, they test. BS...the tests can be worked around and gamed as is....there is always a cutting edge solution they can use that goes undetected. Others will figure it out and use it finally.

Sports is corrupt, especially baseball and football. Eff it. Currently I am really down on it all. I love sports, but I hate that I know in my heart and mind they aren't legit anymore. Then for football and baseball you throw in the crappy officials and umpires and subjective officiating on each and every play just about and it's that much worse. SCAM. One big effing SCAM.
When everybody gets treated the same, I will buy it. Until then, Boston (Red Cox and Pasteriots) and L.A. can get away with everything with either no penalty (Dodgers) or just a slap on the wrist in return for an unlimited number of championships (Cheatriots), so why can't Houston and New Orleans get away with cheating? We know why, but is it right? Two wrongs don't make a right, but punishing only the small-market teams, to me, is a shit-load more wrong than just letting it go.

And, if we are really talking cheating - What is worse: stealing signs, throwing spitballs, or taking P.E.D.s? Should we get the Niekros and Catfish Hunter out of the Hall for cheating? Should we cancel the NFL? Because, if we bust all the cheaters on P.E.D.s, there wouldn't a team left in that league. (Hey. I would be for that, but I doubt many other people would.)
 

Quetzalcoatl

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2, 3 evils don't make a right for Houston. They got caught. The others should suffer the same if caught. BTW just watching ESPN this morning and Stephen A and he brings up a GREAT point. There were guys on that team caught cheating who went to other teams. Alex Cora to the Red Sox and they end up winning the World Series! Another guy to the Mets. They BOTH should be fired from their current positions and thrown out of the league. THEIR titles should be taken away as well. Stephen A. says the situation is absolutely catastrophic for baseball. I'd agree. They got themselves a huge problem.

I think this extends obviously to other sports like football as well. Obviously we know about the cheatriots, and that Ernie Adams guy. Obviously the Niners cheated the cap back in the 80's. The moral in sports is if you don't cheat you don't win. You can extend it to the individual player level and I believe MANY of these guys if not MOST are cheating the PED system by taking supplements that allow them to go undetected. You do not bulk up like players then suddenly become a skinng skrawny guy in one year like Hardwick did. I don't give a damn if he stopped lifting as many weights. He stopped supplementing. Same with all of em. I would BET you that 'incredible' D line of # 1 picks on the Niner team is all supplementing big time and getting aroundthe system. You simply cannot be THAT much stronger/quicker than the avg. O lineman . The Chargers of the 60's did it that way, I hate to admit that. Sid Gillman figured out how to game the system legally...steroids were still legal before they knew what they did and Sid and Co. knew it and used it before the others had caught on. Thus their D line of Faison, Ladd, et al were WAY faster and stronger than the opposing O lines. I think it's happening right now with the Niners .....I'd wager a huge amount it is. I know I know, they test. BS...the tests can be worked around and gamed as is....there is always a cutting edge solution they can use that goes undetected. Others will figure it out and use it finally.

Sports is corrupt, especially baseball and football. Eff it. Currently I am really down on it all. I love sports, but I hate that I know in my heart and mind they aren't legit anymore. Then for football and baseball you throw in the crappy officials and umpires and subjective officiating on each and every play just about and it's that much worse. SCAM. One big effing SCAM.
Rigged.
 

Quetzalcoatl

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After the Red Sox gets penalized for their cheating:

World Series Champions last 5 years:
2015 - Kansas City Royals
2016 - Chicago Cubs
2017 - Fuck the Dodgers
2018 - Fuck the Dodgers
2019 - Washington Nationals

Looks good.
17 and 18 were glorious years.
 

Gill Man

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The dominoes are beginning to fall. Now take away the titles those a holes claim to have won. And suspend them or ban them from baseball......how is this different from Pete Rose?
 

Fender57

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The dominoes are beginning to fall. Now take away the titles those a holes claim to have won. And suspend them or ban them from baseball......how is this different from Pete Rose?
You bring up a good point and it appears you’re not the only one.

 
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Fender57

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Bochy. Showalter. Baker. These are names the Astros are touting. Meanwhile, we got Tingler.

 
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